Author Topic: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?  (Read 270303 times)

Offline Satanic Mechanic

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #60 on: April 09, 2008, 04:37:17 PM »
NeppiTK,
The concept of no civilian losses went out during the first World War.  This was war, not some tea party.  If we had it six months earlier, we would of dropped it on Berlin.  It was either us or them.  The bomb was justified in its use.
Yes, Japan tried to surrender but with conditions.  The surrender had to be unconditional. 
Showing off the first atomic bomb, Gadget, would have done nothing to change the way the Japanese surrendered.  They had to learn the horrible truth that you needed to surrender and surrender unconditionally or you would be destroyed.
Germany and Japan started the war but we sure as hell ended it!

SM

Offline Bob B.

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #61 on: April 09, 2008, 04:42:29 PM »
Sure, but 8 month before thats the US President rejected a surrender...and shortly after the declaration of potsdam he tried to make contact via the schwedish King it was also rejected!

When the Allies told the Japanese what would be an acceptable surrender, the Japanese rejected it.

And the US-Gov didn´t even consider a "Test-Bomb" or demonstration of its power,..

Yes they did.  It was decided that had they announced a demonstration and it failed, the Allies would be worse off than before.  It was determined that the best way to bring the war to a swift and decisive conclusion was the use the bomb unannounced.

Like when they bombed Tokio,... about 100000 died there too

100,000 also died on Okinawa because the Japanese refused to surrender.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2008, 04:44:07 PM by Bob B. »

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #62 on: April 09, 2008, 04:59:15 PM »
The bomb was justified in its use.
Wow,.. you guys seem to justify anything as long as USA did it,... i could get in an arguement and "proof" that the nazis had to kill all that innocent people.. but it would justify anything... same with weapons of massdestruction! Nothing justifies that,.. not in WW2 and not now!

Offline Bob B.

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #63 on: April 09, 2008, 05:06:41 PM »
Germany and Japan started the war but we sure as hell ended it!

Amen, brother!

Any country has a responsibility to protect its own citizens.  Had the US the means to end the war quickly and decisively with a minimum loss of American lives and chose not to use it in favor of a full-scale invasion of the Japanese mainland resulting in several hundred thousand American deaths, then that would have been criminal.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2008, 12:29:55 PM by Bob B. »

Offline DonPMitchell

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #64 on: April 09, 2008, 05:28:04 PM »
Germany and Japan started the war but we sure as hell ended it!

Exactly.  After killing tens of millions of people, enough was enough for the Axis powers.  They needed to be stopped and stopped as fast as possible.  And remarkably, after the war, the US spent a fortune helping Germany and Japan back on their feet.  I don't think we would have been treated like that if we had lost the war.
Never send a human to do a machine's job.
  - Agent Smith

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #65 on: April 09, 2008, 05:28:20 PM »
Its something i hear mostly from kids... : "but HE started it!!" i smashed his head in,.. but HE started it... Great civilized world we live in, if all foreign realtions are based on "who started what"... Who started the crap in middle east.. so who should win then...?!

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #66 on: April 09, 2008, 05:30:29 PM »
And remarkably, after the war, the US spent a fortune helping Germany and Japan back on their feet.  I don't think we would have been treated like that if we had lost the war.

Probably not,.. but don´t forget that the allies broke right after germany was done, and GB and US just put so much money into germany to have it strong against russia! Not because you were so nice! and tought it would be the right thing to do...

Offline Satanic Mechanic

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #67 on: April 09, 2008, 05:36:21 PM »

Probably not,.. but don´t forget that the allies broke right after germany was done, and GB and US just put so much money into germany to have it strong against russia! Not because you were so nice! and tought it would be the right thing to do...
So, let me guess, you are from Germany?  A little bitter over the loss?  So murduring millions of your own people was justified?  How progressive.

SM 
« Last Edit: April 09, 2008, 06:01:36 PM by Satanic Mechanic »

Offline Satanic Mechanic

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #68 on: April 09, 2008, 05:39:21 PM »
Probably not,.. but don´t forget that the allies broke right after germany was done, and GB and US just put so much money into germany to have it strong against russia! Not because you were so nice! and tought it would be the right thing to do...
The Marshall Plan did more for your country than you will ever realize.  The problem after the first World War was to punish Germany and make it pay reparations.  Instead of making you pay reparations after the second World War, we rebuilt you so you would not make the same mistake twice.  Germany and Japan became prosperous because we took over defense so you could focus on your economy and rebuilding.

SM
« Last Edit: April 09, 2008, 05:41:01 PM by Satanic Mechanic »

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #69 on: April 09, 2008, 05:52:40 PM »
So, let me guess, you are from Germany?  A little bitter over the loss?  So killing millions of your own people was justified?  How progressive.

You don´t need to guess...my profile says so! I´m not bitter of the loss... after all i´m glad germany lost, otherwise i would have grown up in dictatorship... but anyway,..

None of you seem really to read what i write...
1. NOTHING JUSTIFIES THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE...NOTHING... and millions of my own... how many german died in the Concentraion Camps,..?! uh?! probably u dont even know how many were killed there at all...
2. The bombing of Cities was a warcrime and not justifyed by any argument possible (doesn´t matter who attack who first)
3. How allies handled the question about "displaced persons" was a crime
4. justifing Nazi trails by the allies and later german courts is a crime
5. dropping an a-bomb on thousands of people, who are desperate to surrender.. yeah IS A CRIME!

Killing somebody because of mostly all reasons you gave me is MURDER! Killing a murder because of what he did is not punishment, but retaliation.. and is a murder to!
NO HUMAN HAS GOT THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LIFE OF ANOTHER HUMAN BEING.. there are no reasons which justify killing another fellow human being,.. and in the cas of an a-bomb... where people didn´t know whats coming to them and they had no chance to escape or even do something about it,... in a working society,..thats murder!

Offline Bob B.

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #70 on: April 09, 2008, 05:56:34 PM »
You don´t need to guess...my profile says so! I´m not bitter of the loss... after all i´m glad germany lost, otherwise i would have grown up in dictatorship... but anyway,..

None of you seem really to read what i write...
1. NOTHING JUSTIFIES THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE...NOTHING... and millions of my own... how many german died in the Concentraion Camps,..?! uh?! probably u dont even know how many were killed there at all...
2. The bombing of Cities was a warcrime and not justifyed by any argument possible (doesn´t matter who attack who first)
3. How allies handled the question about "displaced persons" was a crime
4. justifing Nazi trails by the allies and later german courts is a crime
5. dropping an a-bomb on thousands of people, who are desperate to surrender.. yeah IS A CRIME!

Killing somebody because of mostly all reasons you gave me is MURDER! Killing a murder because of what he did is not punishment, but retaliation.. and is a murder to!
NO HUMAN HAS GOT THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LIFE OF ANOTHER HUMAN BEING.. there are no reasons which justify killing another fellow human being,.. and in the cas of an a-bomb... where people didn´t know whats coming to them and they had no chance to escape or even do something about it,... in a working society,..thats murder!

It's WAR.  It's ugly, but it's WAR.

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #71 on: April 09, 2008, 05:57:22 PM »
The Marshall Plan did more for your country than you will ever realize.  The problem after the first World War was to punish Germany and make it pay reparations.  Instead of making you pay reparations after the second World War, we rebuilt you so you would not make the same mistake twice.  Germany and Japan became prosperous because we took over defense so you could focus on your economy and rebuilding.

uh hu,... you really think that,.. don´t you,... First of all: ww2 already WAS germany second chance...

and why the allies changed from the goal they made at Gibraltar to destroy germany complete to the marshall plan..? and why russia didn´t so the same with his part of germany...?

We didn´t have to pay reparation....? read a historybook...!

Offline NeppiTK

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #72 on: April 09, 2008, 05:58:33 PM »
It's WAR.  It's ugly, but it's WAR.

Thats all you have to say about that...? I wonder what you say about the "new" american wars,.. and how u justify them..

Offline Satanic Mechanic

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #73 on: April 09, 2008, 06:00:32 PM »

We didn´t have to pay reparation....? read a historybook...!
Let me guess.  One of your revisionist history books that tries to white-wash the war crimes Germany committed.

SM

Offline Satanic Mechanic

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Re: What if Germany, Italy, and Japan had won WWII?
« Reply #74 on: April 09, 2008, 06:02:48 PM »
It's WAR.  It's ugly, but it's WAR.

Thats all you have to say about that...? I wonder what you say about the "new" american wars,.. and how u justify them..
NeppiTK,
Do they still have mandatory service in the army in Germany when you turned 18?