Sibrel's astronaut encounters

[Bob B.]

I was making some quips as to WHY this particular thread has digressed from one side to another

I’m not sure what you mean?  I haven’t re-read this entire thread, but from what I recall, we’ve all pretty much despised Bart Sibrel from beginning to end.

from what everyone has offered as criticism and opinion concerning such an encounter, by a confused and assertive individual

Bart Sibrel was by no means confused.  He knew exactly what he was doing and his actions were premeditated and calculated.  Sibrel harassed and provoked an elderly man just to get a response out of him that could be captured on video and then packaged and sold for a profit.

as to attack one's profession and integrity.

In my opinion Bart Sibrel has no integrity.  He is nothing more than a conman who knowingly peddles lies and fabrications at the expense of honorable men and an entire nation.

edit spelling

[Obviousman]

Bart Sibrel's actions and tactics have shown him to be worthy of the scorn heaped upon him.

He should be lampooned, criticized, and despised.

[Harry]

Hey guys,

    Okay. This does help me out and I will (try to) be brief as to your last few comments. Not to lose anyone from some misconceptions of my doings here of late.

    Only as my original intent, was to question the length of this subject heading and such attention it had generated. Seemed to me as beating a dead horse is all. Gave too much attention towards a publicity seeking individual and only turned this whole thread into a soap opera.

    My description of integrity and professionalism was directed towards Mr. Aldrin, not that of Mr. Sibrel. Many of you read past each others' posting comments I have noticed as well, and I was not surprised this may happen. That is the confusion around here when you let your energies get the best of you and make the assumptions that you have, with even other members.

    This is not new to many other website and group community communications I've been witness to and part of in the past. The emotions get turned up, and things get a little too personal as to think comments are made in reference to the members themselves or their own statements, when it was never intended. But hopes that some critcism will be taken in consideration and become some healthy debate.

    If my return posts and the writing portrayed are interpreted as a waste of time (God, what a line), then I'll back off in trying to explain my statements in the manner which I wished to express them. I've just always tried to include all of the evidence at hand and get to the bottom of things.

    That's the way I am.

    So, can we get back to Space Race business among the other forums presented here? Direct me if you will to the appropriate headings, and we can have some continued learning experiences for all of us. In a friendly atmosphere of those who know their business as well. And who are good at making their points made.

    Which of a skill, I may obviously lack.

    But man, I did get a rise out of some of you and that was my meager intention as well. Just testing.

Harry     

         

   

   

[LunarOrbit]

I've spent a good deal of time trying to translate your writing. It is in english, so it should be easy. The gist of it, from what I can tell, is that we are wasting our time discussing Bart Sibrel and other topics that you deem to be beneath you (like the "Buzz Aldrin's Race into Space" game).

It is not up to you to decide what we should or should not talk about here. If you are not interested in a topic then don't read it or respond to it, it's really that simple. I have provided forum categories that appeal to a wide range of members, there is plenty of room for both serious and frivolous topics. You can participate in either or both, or none. It's your choice.

I consider a number of your comments to be insulting, and if you continue on that path you will be banned.

[Bob B.]

That is the confusion around here when you let your energies get the best of you and make the assumptions that you have, with even other members.

No, that is the confusion that comes from your style of writing because we're having trouble understanding what the heck it is you're talking about.  Please keep in mind that we are science-minded people here, not poets.  If you are going to post here then it would behoove you to try to communicate in an appropriate style.  (Being more concise and direct will be a good start.)  If you want to be a member of this forum then I think it is entirely appropriate to expect you to adjust to the culture of the community.  Expecting the community to adjust to your style I find to be quite arrogant.

[Harry]

Hey guys,

     Whoe there, horsey. 

     I should be grateful for such critical observations, and I am. That is how I learn more about not only the subjectmatter involved, but that of those who read it and exchange opinion. Also it does help me in adjusting my writing style without having to offend someone.

     But a few of you are still on the defense, thinking that my arrogance is more obvious than your own, if you read what you have been saying. I was trying to learn how everyone's reasoning applied to such a mundane topic and how it could continue to be relevant to anyone any longer.

     Some expect me to adjust to the 'culture' of this community. I assume that I would just be assimilated along with other curiosity seakers of the forums around here, not expecting to be so chastised as I have been recently. Seems a contradiction in an exercise in freedom of speech, not of an Internet, free thinking, group community.

     I expected a bit more patience, a little understanding of my own ignorance in the meantime, and a level of respect and some courage from some members to better explain their logic to me and others.

     Space minded, but not space-obsessive and all consuming.

     Time to get to the barbeque. Mingle with freinds and family.

     Happy Memorial Day... and remember our fallen astronauts as well.       

     

     

     

     

[LunarOrbit]

But a few of you are still on the defense, thinking that my arrogance is more obvious than your own, if you read what you have been saying. I was trying to learn how everyone's reasoning applied to such a mundane topic and how it could continue to be relevant to anyone any longer.

There you go again, deciding for the rest of us what is mundane and irrelevant. Bart Sibrel is still a relevant topic because he is still out there conning people into believing the moon landing never happened. Just because he wasn't in the news today doesn't mean he isn't still doing harm to society. When he stops lying to people we will stop discussing him.

Some expect me to adjust to the 'culture' of this community.

And you expect the community to adjust to you. Which is a more reasonable expectation?

I assume that I would just be assimilated along with other curiosity seakers of the forums around here, not expecting to be so chastised as I have been recently.

What did you expect? You come here and arrogantly tell us we shouldn't talk about the things that we do, and we're supposed to be happy with that?

Seems a contradiction in an exercise in freedom of speech, not of an Internet, free thinking, group community.

People are free to talk about almost any subject here as long as it is done politely and does not violate a small number of rules that I have set. But when it comes right down to it, this is my forum, I pay for it, therefore if I don't like something I don't have to allow it. If someone came into your home and insulted your family would you allow it (he has the right to free speech, after all), or would you kick him out?

[Bob B.]

Harry,

I find your posts to be very preachy and condescending.  For instance, when LunarOrbit and I indicated that we didn’t understand what your were trying to say in post #54 you responded with:

This is my way of trying to come across for those who may appreciate some variety in correpsondence... something above the 8th grade.

So you imply our communications skills are that of an 8th grader and then you continue with the same hoity-toity style.  If your goal was to foster hostility then you succeeded by insulting our intelligence and education.  If your goal was to make friends then I recommend some self-examination to determine where you failed rather than trying to blame others.

[LunarOrbit]

Well said, Bob. Thanks.

[Harry]

Hey Guys,

     Well, what can I say.

     Forgive me, excuse my misguided intentions or misinterpreted reasoning and explanations. It was never directed towards the members themselves, but I have learned a lot about all of you in the process. And it has appeared that maybe you who have spent so much time and effort in these replies, haven't gotten out to be involved with the things I've found more common among others who'd enjoy long, holiday weekends.

     It was all worthy of a good card game I suppose. Calling each other's hand. Playing one's strategy. Trying to find a common ground and getting something out of it all. Just trying to get to the heart of the matter and understanding the purpose of it all, relative or not.

     Above everything else, some of you have demonstrated a loyalty to this website I find a bit disturbing. I was no threat to anyone, yet as you wrote your postings, had expressed personal insult and made me felt that I was a snob. When just trying to add comment, dig a little deeper into the subject and finding out anything useful to learn on one subject. Never did I want to disrupt the harmony and security of a certain few.

     But in all honesty. I believe I have done so.

     All and all though, please realize this fact.

     Since having to experience the Internet environment since the turn of the century, then maybe some of you can understand what deception there is being represented by the founders and said members of so many given websites... even those who claim to be professionally grounded and based upon their given subject experiences.
     I have been exposed and have turned over my share of false presentations and individuals who only live their lives through these many websites, almost to the point of such personality obsession that it becomes a major concern of their very lives, or so it had seemed.

     That was my hope, that this website had not fallen into such a temptation and become so bias towards others' expressions of reasoning. That's the time when the misssion goes beyond the message as some evangelical circles of thinking. Amen.

     Geeze, was I preaching THAT much. Again, I apologize for being so forward and just was stating my case as well along with yours and too... standing my ground, only being human. I don't have to say I'm sorry for being just human and yes I made mistakes in judgement. Trusting later, that you'd understand.

     But the reality is, I think some of your members aren't being truthful to one another and that is nothing new. It may be hard to determine who's who when one will never have any physical or personal encounters with a fellow member. We all have to trust that what we disclose to one another is the truth and we are not misrepresenting ourselves.

     Gentlemen, I have been burned in the past on the Internet, and learned things may not appear to be as they are after all. I have become to be too cautious and critical in my methods of communication. Forgive me for such methods of examination and trying to determine a path of such reasoning as I do.

     I've said enough. (I'll bet you're all laughing at that one!) Can we move on?

     Thanks for reading. 

           

     

[DonPMitchell]

I haven't really objected to what you have said Harry.  Your writing style is very affected and dificult to read, and I think that is frustrating people and also causing misunderstanding of what you are trying to say.

[Bob B.]

Getting back on topic…

As best as I can tell, after trimming away all the superfluous words, your question is the following:
     

Only as my original intent, was to question the length of this subject heading and such attention it had generated.

All I can say is that I don’t agree the subject has received an exorbitant amount of attention.  The discussion went on for a few pages over a year ago, but half of that was about copyrights and piracy and an off-topic discussion about computers and computer programming.  The thread then lay dormant for about a year until revived a couple weeks ago, receiving another page of posts.

Why do you find this modest amount of activity unusual, particularly considering that Bart Sibrel continues to be an active promoter of the moon hoax theory?  Bart Sibrel is not old news; he is always fabricating new evidence to prop up his lies in an effort to swindle people.  Should we allow such dishonest activity to go on without comment?

[LunarOrbit]

Even if we pretend for a second that all 72 replies in this thread were on topic then that is still only 72 posts over the course of 549 days. Of course, like Bob pointed out, this thread has been taken off topic numerous times and only occasionally returns to discussing Bart Sibrel. I wouldn't consider that an excessive amount of coverage.

[Bob B.]

Heck, the last 20 posts have been generated just in repsonse the Harry's post about why there have been so many posts in this thread!

[Harry]

Very good fellas,

     YES!

     Now you got it.
     This was my hidden agenda. To show some basic intellect and maturity from all of you. At last. But a few hidden truths that aren't relative just now. But I am pleased that my postings had such influence to get to the point. That was the point.

     I'm an organization freak to some level, and I was just hunting for the proper forum headings in which to post further opinion with the understood category to be then analyzed. It did seem during this thread, that it had wandered, but once again appeared to be scattered and chaotic. I think you picked up on that, at last.

     But realize now, it is no longer on the subject of poor Mr. Sibrel, but poor little me. Careful you don't express too much attention on this self... it would then look as if you're trying to flatter me. Ha!

     Sorry if my interpretations left you guys confused and irritated. I think I found out what I needed to know in spite of subject heading investigation and lessons in probability. Wanted to bring you all around to expose a few characteristics which I could study further in relationship to this website. 

     Wasn't this fun?

     But I think I drew a little blood in the process. Good. I wanted to know if your sincerity was intact and the truth was still being represented. I'm not about to be flim flammed by any adolescent who is bright enough to fool me and others by any tactics of deception. If there are, I think I have caught them in mid-flight. But will not pull them down on the carpet just yet. As well, if there are any misrepresentations of backgrounds or professions. After all... I could claim that I was a (retired) department head of some university. But what use would I have of such a modest website as this? 

     This has been an exercise in a degree of 'reality check'. Keep your stick on the ice. 

     I'm all for getting back to business. What about you guys? (defence,defence!)

     See ya at the other topic headings around here. I'm a man, and I can change, I guess.* 


p.s.: *In reference to a standard line of 'The Man's Prayer' from the Red Green Show.